NFC Predictions: Unveiling the Best Teams for the Upcoming Season

Hello, my football friends. This is Darin Hayes of pigskindispatch.com welcome again to the Pig Pen, your portal to positive football history.

And welcome to our second part of our season opener, our preseason predictions with our friend Ed Cleese. Ed, welcome back to the Pig Pen.

Hey, Darin, how are you?

I am doing great, Ed.

We are fresh off of our last recording, last week of recording the AFC teams and how we thought, you know, in our own macabre way of predicting how they would come out.

And I'll let you lay the groundwork out in case somebody missed the AFC version can always go back after this episode and watch it and why don't you tell them about what we're doing?

Yeah, pretty simple. It's a, it's a twist on NFL power rankings and we're incorporating the draft, which we always love to do. So it's really simple.

It's an easy back and forth between you and me. There's 16 teams in the NFC. We're going to pick them in order of how we think they will finish in the regular season. So you're picking the first.

Your first pick is the team that you think will have the most overall regular season wins and your last pick would be the one that you think is going to struggle the most. We're not really incorporating how they do in the playoffs or anything beyond that.

We're just looking for wins, which is kind of how you base power rankings kind of throughout the season is just who do you think is the best? Not necessarily who do you think is going to come on out on top. So has nothing to do with last year or where they finished.

You can pick whoever you want and whatever or you want to.

All right. Well, it sounds good.

And we're going to try to throw a little bit of history behind our fact finding here to keep our theme of football history going as well. And if I remember correctly, you picked first in the afc. Right. So it'll be my selection first. If we're ready to go, we can get right at it.

Hammer it.

All right. I have. I'm going to take the chalk again just like I did in the afc.

And this is seems to be the popular pick for everybody's taken maybe to be the champions of the NFL and for good reason. That's the Los Angeles Rams.

You know, Sean, Sean McVay has a great team that he had coming back from last year and he's added some really important pieces. Number one being Myles Garrett.

Number two might be the return of Aaron Donald and they also on defense went out and got Trent McDuffie, one of the premier cornerbacks of it. So that was.

If there was any weak spot in the Rams last year, it was probably defensively and possibly they may have cured a lot of that up just by those three individuals I talked right there. And some good draft picks and some stuff, you know, they had going on there offensively.

You know, you have Matthew Stafford, Puka Nukua, the whole team coming back basically from last year. Very potent offense, very strong defense. I think they will be the number one seed in the nfc.

Yeah. And I would, I kind of poked around to see if I could come up with a cute number one, but I kept landing on the Rams as well.

They would have been my first pick too. You know, sometimes you get these super teams that come in a little overhyped, but I just feel that they're so solid and they haven't really changed.

They're not adding a lot to what they, what obviously worked last year. What you're adding is, you know, Miles Garrett and Trent McDuffie, you know, two top notch defensive players.

And now for me, the Rams also boast, I think, at least five players. Stafford, Devonte, Adams, Puka, Miles Garrett and maybe Aaron Donald. I'm going to include Aaron Donald because I think he's coming back.

Those five players are either locks for Canton or having Canton careers. And then McDuffie probably, that's probably a stretch for him to say. That's the track he's on. But he's kind of a star corner as well.

So you've just got these super high level, all time great players playing at this grade level with an incredible coach balanced on both sides. Stuff happens in the NFL, injuries, things don't go the way you want, you just never know.

But I think this team is as rock solid as it gets and I think it's a good pick. Number one.

Yeah, and I think the, the history sort of commands that maybe they'll be pretty good too. You know, there's been some failures when teams go out.

I mean, I know your team in Washington went out and got some of the, the great players like in the 90s and late 90s and didn't do work out so well. But recently the Tampa Bay Buccaneers, bringing Tom Brady and Gronkowski on their team, took them to a Super bowl championship.

Just put them right over the edge by having those two players on there. I, I think this Rams team may be similar to Tampa Bay just a few years ago.

I totally agree.

All right, so who do you have as your pick. So.

So, Darren, this is kind of interesting because really, after the Rams, I struggled a little bit. I'm pretty confident. I like my top three in the nfc and I'm confident in my bottom two.

Everywhere in between, I'm like, man, I think you could flip a coin here.

I actually have my number two and my number three teams did not make the playoffs last year, and I have a number 14 team that did, so that kind of tells you where I'm at. My number two pick is the Detroit Lions. I think we're going to have a really solid bounce back. I mean, really bounce back.

I mean, they went 9 and 8 last year, so it's not like they were. They were terrible. There's a lot of reasons. I think offensively they are still uber talented. They've got everything going on.

There's a ton of continuity there.

One thing that I like to point out is their first three home games are the Saints, the Jets, and the Cardinals, and they have a road game with the Panthers mixed in as well. So, in other words, they play Buffalo as well in the first five. So their first five games are about as easy on paper as it kind of gets.

And so I kind of think they're going to get off to a good start. They're going to get off to a hot start. Sometimes when you start hot, it gives you some margin for error. I think they're just a good team.

What Another thing I want to point out is the Lions right now have had four straight winning seasons. Any idea the last time the Detroit Lions had four straight winning seasons?

It hasn't happened again until we're in the midst of it right now, and I think they're going to make it five this year by winning 11 or more games.

All right, well, I agree with you. I think Detroit is going to be.

I have them in my top four, but I have a team that we'll be talking about next that I think may be a little bit of a roadblock to them getting the number two spot. But I agree with you. They. They are loaded. Jameer Gibbs is now a happy camper having a pocket full of money. You know, the.

The offensive line, hopefully they've got some of those situations straightened up to. To keep golf upright, and I think they're ready to go.

I. Yeah, I think they're. I think they're right back on the horse. And we're going to be seeing him as the NFC north champs this year.

Well, that's where I disagree with you, because my next team I'm going to bring up is the Chicago Bears. I have them coming in as a number two spot on my list because I think they're the real deal. They were a little bit young last year.

They had a first year coach. He's, you know, I think he's got his feet under him. I think he's got Caleb Williams and the gang, you know, on the same page.

They understand, you know, what his plan is, what his goal is and his strategy.

And I think they're going to be working a lot more in unison and he's bringing some more of his people on instead of the inherited Bears that he got just a little over a year ago.

And I think they're the real deal and I think Caleb Williams is going to be much better quarterback this year now, having a full year under Ben Johnson's guidance to get them there. And so I have them winning the NFC north and being the number two spot.

And we kind of know what happened to the Commanders the next year.

So I don't think the Bears are going to go quite that far down as the Commanders did unless the Bears have the same level of injuries that Washington did. But you know, last year I looked at their. You go back and look at the Bears schedule from last year.

They played what I would have called nine different coin toss games. Either games that they probably should have lost or games that went right down to the wire could have gone either way.

They went seven and two in those games and then they lost the NFC Championship game. That was another one. So their luck kind of ran out. And I don't mean that in a necessarily a disparaging way because good teams find ways to win.

But if you're rolling the dice that often, there is sort of also a law of averages.

And if you remember, Darren, some of those wins, like the playoff win against the packers, these are like miraculous, like once in a 10 year kind of wins, you know, like crazy plays and wild comebacks, and that's very hard to sustain. And I guess you could say, well, maybe they don't have to sustain it if they've gotten better. And maybe they have, maybe they haven't.

They're already dealing with some injuries, which kind of sometimes happens just naturally. Luther Burden's already been out. They've lost a really important defensive back for pretty much the season already.

They got the target on their backs. You know, it's. The shine wears off a little bit. You know, it's just. It's always a little bit different when you're trying to do it again.

So I don't think the Bears fall apart. I think they're middle of the pack.

Okay, fair. Fair enough. ESPN does say that the Bears have the hardest schedule in the NFL coming up this year, so you have some good merit to that.

But I don't know. I think there's a little bit of magic there, and that's why I'm taking them. Right.

Got it. Well, my next pick is very painful for me to announce. I don't like saying it out loud, but I'm going with the Dallas Cowboys as my.

As my second pick here and the fourth pick overall. I have them as the number three team going in this year. You know, there's. It really boils down to this. You can.

Until Dak comes through in the postseason, he will have that, you know, monkey on his back. He'll have that kind of following him. But the fact is this. He's 83, 55 and 1 as a starter in the regular season.

In other words, when Dak plays, Dallas is good. They win about 60% of their games when he plays. And Darren, they win 75% of their games in the NFC east when he starts, that is off the charts good.

He has given the other teams the NFC East a ton of trouble. He's, by all accounts, he's healthy. He's ready to go.

Pickens and Lamb are arguably probably number two, maybe behind Nakua and Adams as a wide receiver duo in the NFL. Maybe Higgins and Chase in Cincinnati. They're right there. They're very good. Javante Williams is a good back. They've improved their own line.

They've made some pretty significant improvements, at least talent wise on defense to maybe go from bad to. To, you know, league average. And if Dallas has a league average defense, that's probably a 10 to 12 win team.

And that's exactly what I think they will be. Not really saying much about what might happen in the postseason, but in terms of how they're going to be this year.

I think Dallas can be good, really solid.

Yeah, I agree with you. I have them winning the east as well.

I don't have them ranked as high in their power rankings as you do I, but I think that, you know, bringing Rayshawn Gary over from the packers to go with Quentin Williams on that defensive line, that really plugs up a big gap and hole because people were just gashing them last year and that secondary was just getting worn out by getting run over.

Now they can get, maybe even get a little bit pressure on the quarterbacks, help the secondary out and that offense explosive as they come, as you said.

Yep, yep. I hate to say it, I hope I'm wrong.

I, I, but I hope there's, I bet there's a lot of people around that are hoping a Dallas does come through like you said. So yeah, I think that's a solid pick.

All right.

I have my pick. Being the world champions. You know, we haven't talked about him yet.

This is a team that just won the super bowl, you know, six months ago or a little bit over that maybe. You know, this is, these guys are really good.

They lost a little bit, you know, they lost, you know, they really stud back that ended up being a Super bowl mvp, but they got a really good back injarian Price from Notre Dame to come in and you know, maybe take up some of that burden. They still have, you know, what was his name? Sham. Shamble or Sham Charbonneau. Charbonneau.

I knew it was almost a wine, but you know, that to complement and you know, so the rookie doesn't have to come in, take all the pressure. They have solid quarterback play, they are well coached and they have a really good defense that's still coming in this year.

Some key additions that they have, you know, they brought in Dylan Veniman, a safety first round pick, brought a cornerback in the second round and another safety, Xavier woods, came over to them. So they reloaded up that defense from a few people that they lost reloaded on offense.

They're ready to go, but I don't think they're going to overtake the Rams this year.

Yeah, I agree. I had him six, so some people might think that's a little bit of a slight to the super bowl champs and maybe it is a little bit.

Six would still be a playoff team, which is pretty good. And I kind of leaned on history a little bit here, Darren. And this is a little bit anecdotal because it's a little Subjective.

But I want to go back and you know, Mahomes and Brady have been so dominant over the past 25 years in terms of winning Super Bowls. Right.

So I want to look at what happens when non elite quarterbacks win the super bowl and that is no shame or shade being thrown at Sam Darnold because I think we can agree that he proved that he is a good winning quarterback in the NFL. I think we can also agree that he is not going to be in the hall of Fame someday. He is not Tom Brady or Patrick Mahomes or something like that.

So wherever you think he ranks, he's not at the very top. Right. He's not one of the, he's not one of the three best quarterbacks in the NFL Sunday.

All right, so what happens when a non elite quarterback wins the Super Bowl? And history will tell us that the next year it's very difficult to replicate that magic again. The two most recent examples would be the Eagles.

Both of the most recent times that they won the super bowl with Jalen Hurts and with Nick Foles both the subsequent seasons they failed to win a playoff game that next year.

So there's, there's, there's a few examples in there that in other words, we all know how hard it is to repeat and it's way harder if you don't have that like guy to get you over the top in these like 50, 50 games all the time. Because it's going to be harder for the Seahawks this year. It's harder for everybody to, to repeat.

The season's longer, you get more beat up, you don't have as much luck, usually get a few more injuries, things that you are out of your control. And if you don't have that guy at the top, history tells us that it's very difficult to get back to the top.

So that's kind of where I'm coming at with the Seahawks.

All right, so Ed's predicting a little bit of super bowl hangover for this.

Little bit. Yeah, a little bit. Not, not a Fall off the cliff. I have too much respect for Mike McDonald and I do. Their defense is extremely talented.

So they're not going to stink by any means, but they are in a very tough division, Pretty tough schedule outside the division. So I think it's going to be a struggle, a struggle to be in that like 10 win range.

All right, so who do you have for your next pick?

I have another NFC west team, so I actually have the Seahawks in third place in the NFC west because I have the San Francisco 49ers and that is, I had them fourth in the NFC and that is me deferring to Kyle Shanahan a little bit. I am just a huge fan. It's kind of weird. He's been there for nine seasons now. It's hard to believe.

In five of those seasons they've won double digit games. In four of those seasons they won six or less. So they've kind of had these weird years where things kind of fell apart.

They had some injuries and, and his first two years were kind of rebuilding. So the two years that since they've been good, that they've been bad, the season just kind of unraveled and fell apart completely.

If the 49ers are in the mix, they usually win like 11, 12 games every year. I think that's probably, that's going to happen again this year in San Francisco.

There's sort of the, I'm not really sure how they do it, but they do it team like all the time.

You know, they get, they get beat up, they get banged up and you look up and they're 11 and 6 and in the playoffs it just seems to kind of be, well, the, the way it is in San Francisco. They're extremely well coached. They still got purdy, they've got McCaffrey, they do have Mike Evans.

Now if they can figure out the electrical substation and why all of their players keep, you know, crapping out, then they'll be way better off because, you know, they were beat. They were beat to hell last year, Darren. And they made it all the way to the divisional playoffs.

I see no reason to think that they probably won't do something similar again.

Yeah, except for one thing. Father Time always wins. And you know, they are getting a little long on the tooth. I mean, look at their wide receiver room coming up.

You know, Christian Kirk, not that old, but the first year with the system. Debo Samuel coming back, you know, he's, he's getting a little gray hair. Mike Evans, like you mentioned, he's a Little long on the tooth as well.

You know, some of the younger receivers, like Purcell, I think he's injured. Who knows what he's going to do, you know, iuk, you know, I don't know that he's even on the roster this year. Yeah.

So I'm not sure what's going on with the receivers. Christian McAffrey is no spring chicken and he is, you know, a little bit on the smaller side. Their offensive line a little bit old but good.

So I think they're going to hold the fort.

I think much like you were talking about the Seahawks, I think they're going to be middle of the pack, but they are in just a brutal division with the Rams and the Seahawks and the Cardinals coming on strong too. You don't know how they're going to be. Plus they have a pretty difficult schedule coming up this year.

I think they are going to be a playoff team, but maybe just squeak in with maybe one of the later wild cards.

All right, fair enough. All right.

I'm going to take one of those surprise teams like you did with Dallas we Talked about before. 42% Of the teams from the previous year on average are replaced by new teams as playoff teams.

And I'm going to say the New Orleans Saints are going to be there. I have them as my next pick. I am liking what's going on down there. Coach Kellen Moore is really bringing things around.

I think he's got a good, young, solid quarterback to build off of. You know, just got some wide receiver help with Jordan Tyson as their number one pick. Chris Olave is happy.

It's like we were talking, you know, Jameer Gibbs being happy. Well, Olave is real happy with his big fat paycheck bump in pay that he has.

And they also got Trevor Travis Etnay or a chain or however you say, you know, to compliment Alvin Camara who doesn't have to be that, that work load horseback, you know, because he's, he's getting a little up there in age. I think he's on the other side of 30 now and but so they got a well balanced, talented young and old team. They're up and coming.

I think they play in a, maybe perhaps with a weaker divisions in the NFL and I think they're just going to, they're going to go ruckshod over all their opponents in that division, you know, go 5 and 1, 6 and O type of thing and you know, when, when their fair share of their outside of divisional games and be right there in the hunt. I know you were talking earlier about them being one of the easier games for. I forgot who we were talking about earlier. The Lions.

I think they may give the Lions a run for their money because they're, they're up and coming and maybe they're the Lions of like three years ago.

Yeah, I, I, I don't totally disagree.

I had, I still have, I still have four teams ahead of them on my list, but I am picking them to win their division, which tells you what I think of their division because I have the Saints 11th in the NFC winning their division. So that kind of gives you, that gives you a little bit of a hint or a clue or where I might be going on some of these other picks.

But I actually just totally agree pretty much with everything you said. They started last year 2 and 10 and they finished, they went, they got themselves to 6 and 10 and then they lost their last game of the year.

So they had the little four game winning streak in the, at the end of the season. And while in some ways it's, you know, they didn't play great teams, I think they beat the Titans and the Dolphins and maybe the jets in there.

So it wasn't like they were killing people or anything. But Tyler Schuck kind of got, kind of got going very quietly there in the second half of the season, looking good.

I think Kellen Moore is a smart coach and like you said, I think they just have more than people think. And this is maybe another one of those NFC south teams that wins the division at 8 and 9.

Okay, fair enough. Fair enough. Who's your next selection?

You know, sometimes when you're doing like a fantasy football draft and you're like, oh man, this guy is so boring. I do not want to take him here, but I just know he's going to be okay. And so I am to.

I have the Green Bay packers as number five in the nfc and I don't love them. You know, they're, they're fine. But I do think they're a fairly safe bet to get to at least nine wins.

They've actually made the playoffs 12 more times. That is a lot. And you know, about 15, 16 season span there and they've even, they've even had playoff success.

They've lost the NFC Championship game four times in that, in that in that span, couple of them are really close to like the one in Seattle that was, you know, the heartbreaker. And then a few of their one and done playoff seasons were also like heartbreaking losses.

Including last year in Chicago where they blew the game they hadn't won. They should absolutely should have won in advance. You know, the year before they were one and done and played the Eagles.

So they're just a very steady presence. They didn't do a whole lot in the off season kind of either way. So I, they're probably going to be a very similar team.

I just have no reason to think that they're going to be much worse or much better. And what they were was pretty good and so I think that's kind of going to be where they are again.

Yeah, I think I agree with a lot what you're saying and I think one important piece really hinges on their success and that's Micah Parsons. That's why they didn't add a whole lot this year because they used draft capital with Dallas to get him last year.

And, and if you remember right, he was injured most of last year. I don't think he's off the IR yet or he might be on the PUP list coming into the season.

I don't know, you know, how much action he's going to see, how quickly, how effective he's going to be. That's all some, some variables that are really.

The packers are really relying on to really boost that defense to go with a fairly strong offense with Jacobs running the ball. Love dishing it out to some, some newer receivers because he.

Remember they lost a Romeo Dobbs from last year and I think they lost another receiver too. If I'm not, if I'm not. But they were stacked last year so they have plenty in a stable to replace.

I just don't know that they have that veteran receivers that can do it. But I think Micah Parsons is the big key factor in how they will succeed.

It's a big year for Jordan Love too. Probably time to take that next little step if he has any.

Yeah, yeah.

Well, I'm gonna say one that you are gonna probably cringe over and not like me very much, but I think the Philadelphia Eagles are gonna be my next selection.

I think, you know, they are, you know, they're an up and down team, but I, I look at it, their offensive line and their defensive line are so stout and are so key to, to their success. That's why they can do the, you know, the tush push and that's why they can hold teams down and rushing, you know, more times than not.

And it really helps out the rest of your team. Your back end, your offense back end of your defense.

When you're off your offensive and defensive lines are absorbing the blows and winning at the line of scrimmage and most of the time dominating the line of scrimmage. And I think that's a big factor. And they're, they're still pretty talented. They lost AJ Brown, but they still have Devonte Smith.

They still have, you know, some other good players, Hertz and Saquon. Saquon. Thank you, Mr. Mumble Mouth here. Saquon Barkley. Defensively, they still got some stars in the back end.

I think they're going to hold their own. They won't win a division we already talked about. We both think the Cowboys are going to win that division, but.

But I think they'll be within a game or two of Dallas and taking it to the end.

Well, I've got the Eagles ninth overall in the NFC and I've got them third in the NFC east this year. I think this is their official step back season and it's really simple. I think their offense stinks and there's some numbers out there to prove it.

They were 24th in the NFL last year in offense. Okay. And if you think it was like, well, just because they kind of hit the skids in the passing game. Nope. They were also 18th in rushing.

They did not run the ball very well at all last year. They threw it terribly. They were 19th in scoring.

And it actually got worse as the year went on, culminating in a really, really pitiful offensive showing in the playoff game against the 49ers. Now, if you're of the belief that the A.J.

Brown Jalen hurts marriage was so fractured that that was what was sinking the offense and like it's addition by subtraction to, you know, trade him to the Patriots. Well, maybe, but, you know, we'll see. I look at it more as he is a great weapon.

They couldn't really figure out how to utilize him and now they don't have and they've replaced him with a rookie, Lemon from usc. You know, we'll see. First round pick could be awesome, could be terrible, could be anywhere in the middle. You know, there's.

I don't put a ton of stock into like camp reports and you know, when everybody's in their shorts and, you know, running around, it's hard to tell anything. But there's, there's some stuff there that things aren't Looking so hot.

And you know, now defensively that team is loaded, they're really well coached, they've got a ton of talent on defense and so their defense is probably going to win them plenty of games this year. But I think the offense is bad. I think it's getting worse and I, I don't think it's going to be any good at all this year.

So that's why I have them as almost like a middle of the pack, but like fading back. Like it wouldn't surprise me if we have a surprise seven or eight win season from the Eagles this year.

And yes, I'm saying that with a proper amount of hate in my heart.

I, I saw you had a little bit of an evil grin on your, your lips as you said that. So fair enough. Okay, so who's your select?

Well, this segues perfectly, doesn't it?

Because the team that's going to finish right ahead of them and the team that's going to wind up in the last wild card in the NFC this year is the Washington Commanders.

And you know, it's, it's funny because I do think to a certain extent people have almost completely forgotten about what the quarterback did just two years ago or the last time we saw him kind of healthy, you know, and I know that the mantra for Jaden is for Jaden Daniels is going to be, well, he's not going to be able to stay healthy. He's fragile. Well, last year was a disaster.

He didn't have any major injuries, but he had four minor ones that kept him out all year, in and out, and then at the end of the year they were out of it. So they just held him out. It was a, the whole season fell apart last year when he got hurt. Terry McLaurin was out during that time as well.

And then like half the team was gone by week eight. So it was just a disaster of a year. Prior to last year though, Darren, he has started 70 of 72 games in his college and pro career.

This is not a guy that has traditionally been injured, not a guy that's traditionally been hurt, and he's had no surgeries in his life, no major injuries. Kind of had a bad luck year last year and the last time we saw him in for real, he was scorching teams on the road in the playoffs, winning games.

And while I don't think they're going to get all the way back to that 12 and 5 magic season where they did have a lot of things really go their way, I do think that their offense Very much stabilizes this year. It's the first time Terry McLaurin will ever have a true running mate with Stefan Diggs next to him there on the outside.

David Blau is the new offensive coordinator. They have a new defensive coordinator. They added about 9 to 10 depending on their roles.

New defensive players that are going to be in the rotation if not starting. That's a ton. That doesn't mean they'll be good, but at least they've taken a major weakness and addressed it significantly.

Significantly including with one major free aging contract Adafe away and their first round pick, Sonny Styles.

So they've addressed a lot of the weaknesses but the biggest thing of all, Darren, is number five is back and I'm going to say his name and hold up my number five. And they're going to be. They're going to be a potent offense this year and they're going to get to nine wins.

Don't know if they're going to get over that. Not sure if nine gets them in or not, but I think they get to that. They're going to be between like 8 and 10.

So split the difference the same nine minutes.

All right, that's fair enough. I have them right about in there. I have ended up having them 11th in the, in the NFC. So I mean they're.

I'd be talking about them next if you would have picked another team. Couple things that worry me about them, I felt really more comfortable about them a few weeks ago.

But Laramie Tensil going down might be out for the year with that torn triceps. So that, that's a big question mark. That's a big factor for, for how good that Jaden Daniels can be and how healthy he can be.

You lose your big guy on your blind side. That's big. I love the Sonny Stiles signing or the draft, you know, Ohio State, you know, the great backers linebacker you there that they have.

I like their wide receiver Antonio Williams out of Clemson that they got to.

To go with, you know, the receivers you already talked about and you know, I think that they have a lot of potential but I think it's a lot of people, the back of their minds, including mine, is Jaden Daniels.

Is he for real or is he maybe like an RG3 career or you know, Desean Watson where you come out of college and you have a really strong, you know, freshman year and you know, then you backslide a little bit, injury, whatever, you know, coaching changes, I don't know. I think the jury's still out on him, but I will not disrespect him like his college does with the jersey number that's going on.

So we'll just leave that, that lay where it is. But I think they're, I think you're right in a right spot with Washington.

I'm not sure if they're going to make the playoffs, but I think they're going to be right around a.500 team.

The one thing that I'll say to kind of respond to that real quick is that Jaden's already accomplished way more than those guys. You mentioned what he was able to do in that rookie year, what was. Didn't feel very flash in the pan.

They were, they were a game away from the Super Bowl. You know, he went into Tampa, he went into, he went into Detroit and he lit those teams up in the playoffs.

That's not something that Deshaun Watson has ever done. It's not something that RG3 did. It's not something that any of the other quarterbacks that have kind of been flashes in the pan have done.

So we've kind of seen him do it already in these big spots and he did it for 20 games in a row. So that's kind of where I feel like the guy just needs to stay upright and if he does, he's going to be just fine. But your next pick.

My next pick. I'm in that gray area that you were talking about, but I'm sort of the middle of the pack thing.

I think these teams are all mashed together in my mind.

But I think the top of that, I think the Tampa Bay Buccaneers come to mind now they lost, you know, Mike Evans, but they still have, you know, Baker Mayfield has some great decision making. They are, you know, solid coaching.

You know, there's a, I wouldn't say that's the elite coaching, but they got a good coaching staff that's consistent, great offensive line, great defensive line.

Just like I talked about the Eagles, you know, when that you can win some games when your trenches are performing for you and winning that battles every play. But I'm not sure that they have the weapons to first of all win the South.

I, like we said, I think New Orleans is going to run away with that and I don't know that how far they can go. If they do make the playoffs, can they win a playoff game?

I'm not so sure about that because they're probably going to have to travel up north to one of the colder weather teams to play and I'm not sure how much success they'll have. But I have them right in this spot here.

Yeah, I had them one spot lower than that. I have one team ahead of them still. I had the Bucks 12th. I just think at this point it feels very neutral, Very stuck in neutral.

Todd bowles, in his four years with the Bucks, has gone 8, 9, 9 and 8, 10 and 7, 8 and 9. And so you can kind of see that's the neighborhood they're in. And. And they kind of did nothing this offseason.

They really didn't make any sort of splash either way.

They're sort of just running it back with a team that was very meh, especially towards the second half of last year, where they were probably actually a little below meh actually by the end of the year. And, you know, they got to get the ugly thing with Baker's contract. Now, that might motivate him.

You know, an angry Baker sometimes is good, but like you said, I don't think he has a ton of help. There's not a whole lot on either side of the ball that really sticks out.

And I think I wouldn't be surprised if we see the box as sort of more of like a six or seven win team this year. I think that's probably kind of where this is more trending. I'm not very high on them.

Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised if they went that route either. That's what I said. It's kind of everything's mashed together with these teams in here and they could go either way for them. But I agree with you.

I've got this next team. I've got them 10th, which sounds bad, but this is sort of like my last. Hey, this is.

I got a little bit of an up arrow with this team, and that's the Minnesota Vikings. And the reason I said. And I had a real. I almost had them a slot or two higher, too.

The reason I say that is they were a fairly respectable team last year with a disaster at quarterback. Their quarterback situation was laughably bad between McCarthy and Wentz and whoever else they were throwing out there. It was.

It was horrible, just awful.

And we clearly know what they think internally about JJ McCarthy as well, because they had went out and found a replacement for him as soon as they could. I know they were kind of doing some lip service there, but it sounds like Kyler Murray is going to be the starter. So they.

We all know what the internally, the vikings think of J.J. mcCarthy now as well. And I am not as an oh, you guy. I'm actually not A huge Kyler fan.

I'm not huge fan of his play style, but I am a really big fan of o', Connell, the coach. I think he's super smart. I think whatever is there to be drawn out of Kyler, he's going to be able to do. He's going to be able to get it out.

And that defense, Darren, they were third in the NFL in defense last year and similar to like the Eagles. So they're a bad in every capacity of offense. The Vikings are sort of good in every capacity of defense.

Gets the run against, pass forcing, turnovers, all that kind of stuff.

So if their offense can just be okay and not be terrible, then I actually think the Vikings have a shot to be this year's like, whoa, that team went 11 and 6 and won their division. Like I think they are in that mix. I don't quite have the guts to pick it, but I think they're closer to 11 than they're going to be to 6.

You know, I would tend to agree with you except for one thing. They also play in a division that has three very good teams in it that they have to fight for.

And I think just by that attrition they're going to take some, a few lumps here and there. I don't think they're going to go clean through that division by any means.

I don't even know that they will sweep any of those three teams, maybe a split with a couple. So I think that's their divisional record is what's going to hold them back and maybe they get have a record.

Maybe it's a 10, 11 win season, maybe it's a six or seven win season. Again, I'm not sure how it's going to go with them because I'm not a firm believer that Kyler Murray is the answer.

But that takes me to my next pick which, you know, when you talk about quarterback controversies, I don't know what the heck is going on here, but I've got to take this team. That's the Atlanta Falcons. You know, Kevin Stefanski leaves the Browns, gets hired by the Falcons.

You know, we see that Cousins, you know, is out the door and so it looks like, you know, Penix is going to be the quarterback. But wait a second, they signed to a, to a contract and so now they have two quarterbacks again.

And I'M not sure if they've decided on one yet at this point in the season. In the preseason, I'm not sure who the leader is.

I don't know and I don't know the rest of the team knows who their leader is at quarterback, and I think that's going to play a factor. Stefanski is a good offensive coach, but I don't think he has it.

To take a team consistently in the playoffs has been proven some very talented Browns fans, teams that he had early on that just really couldn't get anything going consistently. And I think it starts when you don't have a quarterback and I think he's getting them in that boat again.

Yeah, he sits the fancy, is a good offensive coach. And my question is, is he, you know, how many games in a row did he coach the Browns without scoring 20 points?

What was some sort of crazy record, you know? And you can say, oh, you didn't have the talent. That's what an offensive coordinator is supposed to do. Right.

You're supposed to be able to find ways with what you got to max it out. I don't think he did that at all in Cleveland.

I think he has his moments like three or four years ago when he brought Joe Flacco off the couch and Joe Flacco lights up the league, you know, he right offense for that guy sometimes, you know, he doesn't find the right offense for some of his other 20 quarterbacks or wherever he had when he was with the Browns that started games.

Yeah, I'm not. I'm not high on Stefanski and I'm not high on the higher and I'm not high on the Falcons at all. I have them 15th in the NFC.

I actually still have two teams ahead of them. I just think they're going to be bad and I think it's going to be kind of ugly. They do have Bijan Robinson, you know,.

So they were so bad you didn't even keep them in the nfc. You put them in the afc.

Sorry. Yeah, sorry. Yeah, they're gonna be.

That is bad when you get.

Yeah, you've been relegated. They are bad. The quarterback situation is bad. I think if Penix were to stay healthy, he's okay. K. But we've seen tua.

We know what TUA is at this point and it's just not. It's just not a good situation.

You know, their first round pick from last year, James Pierce, is already suspended for the first eight games of the season. So it's just kind of got like a bad Vibe a bad feel and it's just not.

I just.

They're just not a good team. Yeah.

And isn't two is right handed? Right.

No, he's lefty.

He's the lefty. So Pennix and him are both left. Okay. So they, they both can. Okay. I was gonna say that might be complicated too if you have a two quarterback system.

One's a lefty, one's a righty, but yeah, they'll be spinning the ball the same way. So. All right.

Yep. So the. I'm going to. I solve my number 13 team on the board and I am selecting the New York Giants.

Another team that I'm probably going to say wins six or seven games, but I think they could wind up closer to 8 or 9 more likely than if they would be at 3 or 4. Meaning I think this is another team with a bit of an up arrow. You know, I am actually not a huge John Harbaugh fan.

I think, I think he was getting by on reputation there for a long time those last several years in Baltimore. However, he certainly has a very strong track record. You can do a whole lot worse.

And the Giants are kind of in need of a stabilizer right now and he may very well do that.

And it's kind of funny when I, when you look at the history me as an NFC east fan, you think of the Giants, how consistent they've been over the years. Well, they are in a 13 season streak now, Darren. We're 11 of those 13 seasons. They have finished third or fourth in the. Just in the division.

They haven't even finished in second place. But twice in those 13 years they have, they haven't won it at all. So third, they've gone 13 years without winning there, right?

Actually 14, I think since they've won the division and in that whole span they've not even been close. So this is sort of a bad long run for the Giants in their history that the fans really haven't experienced before.

And so, you know, in the old days you could kind of say, oh, the Giants were down a few years, but we can expect them to come back. And they're out of that now.

So they're kind of like floating in this Neverland of, you know, maybe the Giants are kind of a bad organization all of a sudden and they're brought in Harbaugh out to try to resuscitate it. I'm iffy on Dart. I think he's got some talent. I think he's a little erratic.

You know, he's a guy that throws his body everywhere, you know, so he's, you know, he's kind of wild in how he plays and you know, I'm just not sure. There's some things I like, some things I don't. I think they could kind of go either way.

I just, but I think they're a bottom of the pack NFC team, but one that's going to be probably worth watching.

Yeah, I, they're an interesting team.

You know, I think Scatter Boo's back and healthy this year and I think that was sort of a letdown for that team when, when he got hurt it was sort of almost identified their season and you know, because it just sort of mirrored it because when he got hurt, I think Jackson Dart didn't have that, you know, that guy he could count on to, to get the, the hard yards. Not that they didn't have other backs that could run the ball, but I think there was just a little bit of magic by those two rookies in there.

And I agree with you. I think Jackson Dart gets a little bit dangerous where he throws the ball. I think he gets dangerous by putting his body on the line.

In the NFL you can't do that. It's not like college and one of these guys is going to pepper him into the sidelines and be wearing a bench or something as a necklace.

But I, I worry about him a little bit.

He, and there's always that sophomore slump of quarterbacks too, which you know, we've seen happen time and time again and he may suffer a little bit of that. And I agree with you about Harbaugh. I think he's a steady coach. I don't think he's a miracle worker that people make him out to be.

I think he had a very good front office with Baltimore who really knew how to identify and find talent and extend contracts and play the shell game with the salary cap and just keeping some talent in there. And I think he's got a little bit more of a challenge now that he's in New York.

Great.

All right, well, I'm going to take a team that we haven't talked about that was a playoff team last year and that's the Carolina Panthers. I'm taking them with this second to last selection for one, that's not, not much left after them.

And, and two, I, I, I, I, I'm still not a big believer in, you know, their quarterback. I, I don't know that young. Is that that guy coming out of college that was going to be a franchise saver?

I think he's sort of up and down a little bit. You know, he's hot and cold. And when you're hot and cold, you're. You're going to be a.500 or worse team. And I don't think you can.

You can live on that. And I think they've got a lot of youth. Maybe another year or two, maybe they got some potential. I mean, I love their backs.

I love Chubba Hubbard, you know, coming out of the backfield. But really, I don't feel real confident of anybody else except maybe some defensive players that you can count on. And I think they're going to be.

Might be a rough year for them. Maybe like a three or four win a season for the Carolina Panthers.

Yeah, we agree. I had him. I had him second to last. I'm sorry. I had him 14th. I have the Falcons behind him, too. Yeah, I'm not, I'm.

I look back at last year and, and what I will say is the, the. The last impression we had of the Panthers was extremely favorable. They played that Rams playoff game. They were fantastic in that game.

And Bryce Young was great. He was fantastic and they played well. And I think, you know, that. That gives me a little bit of pause.

Like, they ended on such a high note, even though they wound up losing that game. But prior to that, they went 2, 5 last year against teams that made the playoffs in the regular season. And a few of them were kind of ugly.

And one of those wins was actually earlier in the year against the Rams. I don't know if you remember that game. It was just this crazy.

Remember, Stafford threw a stupid interception at the end, you know, so it was kind of like this wild thing. So they really struggled against good teams last year. And I'm with you on Bryce Young. I gotta see more. I don't, you know, I just don't see that.

I'm just not that high on them. I think this is probably. You said three or four wins. I'm probably thinking more five, six, something like that.

And in that division, nothing will surprise me. You know, if you told me that the Panthers are going to win it at 8, 9 again, I'd say, okay, yeah, I could see that.

But I just.

I'm not too high on them, but I guess can I just pass on my last pick? Because I think I wound up with the jets as my last pick in the afc, if I can remember. Maybe you did. I can't remember.

I think I wound up with the Jets.

Yeah.

And I would actually have this team behind them. I Have the, I have the air. The Arizona Cardinals, they are earlier in the pot. I didn't want to spoil it.

You said something like, who knows about the Cardinals? They could be. I think we know this is a. This is going to be very, very ugly, Darren. I think that they could be in that 1 to 2 win range.

That's how bad I think this, this is looking for them. First of all, they play in a brutal division, as we know with the rams, Seahawks and 49ers.

And if go look, I think you probably haven't spent a whole lot of time scouring the Cardinals schedule, but I would suggest going and looking at their first like 10 or 11 games. It is off the charts hard. Like it is borderline unfair.

Their schedule and ESPN has them as the 30th most difficult schedule coming in.

But just go look at it. Just, I'm telling you, go look at it. It is the first like eight, nine games are so hard.

They also have this very weird thing where I think all of their easier games are at the end of the year and they're at home. They have a very weird thing. I don't think I've ever seen it before. They play five of their last six games this year at home, which is odd. But.

But do you know what that means?

People want to vacation in a warm spot in December.

Early on they're on the road a lot.

And you know, you're throwing out Jacoby Brissette and then the other thing that really bothers me about them is, you know, while the running back is coming back into favor in the league a little bit, we see that with the contracts and where they're getting drafted again, that's kind of fun to have the running backs kind of matter again. I think it's. We still know it's a short shelf life position, right?

So if you're going to draft a running back in the top five, you better have your sight set on using him and being a very good team in those first few years.

You have him and they're just going to beat the hell out of Jeremiah Love this year is my guess is that he's going to get the ball a lot and he's going to get hit a lot and they're going to win a couple of games and they're going to put a ton of miles on. So I don't think it's a smart pick. I think you should go a different direction thinking a little bit more long view.

There is a bad football team with a very bad quarterback situation. A brand new coach in a brutal division and so grab your ankles, Cardinals fans. It's going to be a long, it's.

Going to be a long year.

Well, I don't, I don't think it's all doom and gloom with them because I think, for one thing, I don't know Brissette's going to make it through the whole season. I think either by getting benched or by injury or, you know, whatever.

I think Carson Beck is going to make a few starts this year, maybe even before mid season. And you team that up with love and you still have, you know, Connor there as a running back, so love doesn't have to take all of the snaps.

But I question, you know, other teams, I've said, you know, hey, they're solid in the trenches. I question the Cardinals offensive defensive lines.

I think they've made some, maybe some very questionable decisions like you said in the draft, where they maybe could have got some, some of that help that they much needed and maybe they did. Maybe some of their other draft picks, I haven't studied it real close. Will help them eventually. But I don't think this is a year for the Cardinals.

I think it's gonna be a very long year for Arizona. Do you want to, do you want to hear these games?

Sure.

And I want you to tell me where the winds come. Let's read them off real quick. Hold on one second. I'm pulling it up right now.

If I can read Darren. Okay.

Oh, well, you know what? Never mind. My computer's not working. But go look. It's bad.

I can probably bring it up while you're, you're talking here.

About. At the Chargers, Week one, win or loss?

Oh, that's a loss. I think. Seahawks, week two, I think that's probably a loss.

49Ers on the road, week three.

Oh, that's probably a loss at the Giants. Week four, that might be a possibility to win that one.

Okay. Hosting the Lions,.

Probably not so good for them.

At the Rams.

Not good for them.

It just keeps going and going.

Okay, Broncos, probably a bloodbath at the Cowboys maybe.

Oh, come on. At the Seahawks.

No, no.

Athletes.

Rams again. How many times they play the damn.

Rams at the Chiefs? No, we're, we're past Thanksgiving Darren, and you said. You said two maybes.

Yeah.

So there you go.

Commanders. I wouldn't give the commanders that game necessarily.

Fine. There you go. Okay.

Eagles. I wouldn't necessarily give them that game. Jets. I wouldn't give them that game.

Once we get to December, they've got a shot.

Saints, Raiders.

Yes.

They could end up with four or five wins once.

Once we get to December. Yes. Yes.

Well, I had them as my last team in the nfc, too. I'm not. I'm not defending them in any way.

I'm just that maybe there's a glimmer of hope because of the youth that's on what they have coming up here on offense, defense. I'm not sure. A little scary there. Okay, so we have it picked up. You know, you can review here if you want to go through the review.

Yeah, real quick.

I wound up with The Lions, Cowboys, 49ers, Packers, Commanders, Vikings, Giants and Cardinals, which is going to be a much better outcome than the Rams, Seahawks, Bears, Eagles, Saints, Bucks, Panthers and Fountains.

Okay.

Which is your lot.

Okay. All right. You can stick with those Cardinals then. That you just. I'm just. You just denounced.

Not. I'm just proud of you for not insisting that you got to take the Steelers in the NFC as well.

Yeah, well, I. I would have if I could have, but I'm sure you would. No, I think the NFC might be the stronger conference. It seems to go back and forth every four or five years.

And I think a few years ago, the AFC had to. Definitely had to advantage when Mahomes and the Chiefs were riding high.

I think maybe that has really swung over, especially to the NFC west, where it's really loaded and brutal. And I think the NFC north is right behind them with some really good teams up there.

Yeah, the NFC is probably. The NFC is definitely deeper and it might be better. You could maybe argue that the AFC is still a little bit better at the very top. But.

But, yeah, I would think that top to bottom, it's. It's. It was harder to come up with the rankings in the NFC than afc.

There were several teams in the AFC I was very comfortable kind of burying and not so much in the nfc.

Yeah, very true. All right, Ed.

Well, we are, you know, got everybody warmed up here for the season, and we're going to be starting here in just a short amount of time with our weekly shows of talking about the games, predicting, telling a little bit of history from the week that just was played, you know, just shortly after it's done. And we're gonna have a lot of fun here.

You can catch full versions on the podcast Pixie and Dispatch at your favorite podcast provider on Spotify, YouTube and all those good things.

Apple Podcasts and the YouTube video itself will have the shortened condensed version a little bit more History Based with Ed Cleese so Ed, we really thank you for joining us here today. Thanks for the great idea and we will talk to you again real soon.

Thanks Darren. See you soon.

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